Todd Packer- October 8, 2025 (Edit)
Todd Packer: [00:00:00] I had a actual backpack that, uh, I could put on if I needed to and, and, and, and, and walk home, you know.
And so we were, um, but I physically, I wasn't in shape to do that. I had this stuff, but physically, I, I wouldn't have been able to walk home.
Riley: Today I've got my cousin Todd on here and, and Todd has, uh, well crap, we've been friends my whole life and cousins. So, so we're, uh, Todd's got an interesting story. So his, he, he. Grew up at his dad as a, as a long haul trucker. [00:01:00] And since I just was a little boy and my earliest memories were always these big trucks that would pull in once in a while. And, you know, Todd was always on board and coming, jumping off there with his, from his, you know, dad coming back from a big trip. And, and it just seemed like an interesting life to me.
And then as, as Todd grew, he, he went into that industry and has had some pretty, pretty remarkable success there. Um, and then later in life here, he's, he's started up some other, other adventures, uh, I want to talk about. So some of those have been some physical goals, uh, just fitness goals. Some of them have been, uh, you know, some other, other goals as far as, uh, starting a YouTube channel and, and building into that.
And so, Todd, I I just wanna welcome you to the show, man.
Todd Packer: Hey. Thanks Riley. It's an honor. It's a pleasure.
Riley: well talk to,
Todd Packer: Thanks for inviting me.
Riley: that. Um, tell the audience kind of who you are, where you grew up, what life looked like a kid.
Todd Packer: So, uh, I grew up [00:02:00] in, uh, block foot Idaho, uh, which is about 30 miles south of where, where Riley grew up. And I've got great memories of, of Riley and he was a little bit younger than me, but not, it's funny how now I don't feel like you're any younger than me. I feel like. We're here. I don't know if that's just part of getting older or what, but Riley was a little, little younger than me.
And I remember, uh, the, uh, the biggest, probably the, the best memories or the biggest memories that stand out in my head of, of Riley, just for for a second is, is probably Christmases. Uh, Christmases was a, was a big part of our family, and we would, uh, we would get up, just my grandparents loved Christmas and we would get up literally just ridiculous early, you know, uh, four o'clock in the morning they would show up at our house and there was a whole ritual behind, uh, uh, how we would get woken up with some sleigh bells and, and then we would pack up and, and we would head to Riley's house.
And, and, and [00:03:00] Wake Riley up and his family. And, and then we'd all end up at my grandparents' house on, on, uh, the Christmas afternoon and, and just relax and hang out as a family. So the, uh, Riley's mom was, was one of my favorite people in the whole world. I loved my, I loved Riley's mom and my Aunt Patty and, and I've got great memories of, of, of my Aunt Patty.
But, um, and then I grew up in Blackfoot, Idaho, and then, uh, started, started my truck driving career in, in Idaho. And, uh, and then it's funny, you never, you never know where life's gonna take you. And now, currently I live in, in North Carolina, and I never thought I would live all the way across the, the country.
Idaho's, my Idaho's, where I'm, I'm from, I consider Idaho. I, Idaho is still my home, but, uh, I live in North Carolina and, and, and it's home now. So when I, I have an opportunity to visit Idaho, uh, every few months with my work, so I'm very blessed there. [00:04:00] And so, but, but North Carolina's, north Carolina's my home.
I when it comes to truck driving. Let me, let me tell you a little bit about that. Um, Riley touched a little bit on, uh, my passion for, for truck driving. It did come, it come from my, my dad. Um, I feel like I'm one of the luckiest guys in on the planet. Truly. I feel like I, I'm so lucky because I don't know, uh, if anybody remembers, but in kindergarten they would, you know, ask you what you wanted to do when you grew up.
And we all had ideas. Everybody had, uh, I wanted to be a fireman, a police officer, you know, I wanted to be a, uh, the kids wanted to be a, a, a football player or, or an astronaut, you know, I mean, and I, I wanted to be a truck driver. I wanted to be a truck driver. Since the time I was, uh, had memories of, of what I, what I wanted to be.
So I, I feel like I'm one of the luckiest guys in the world to be actually able to live my dream. It may [00:05:00] be not everybody else's dream, but it was my dream. And I am, I'm so honored and so blessed to be able to have actually done my dream and get up. You know, it ha it didn't, it didn't even seem like a job.
Uh, it's funny, I was talking to somebody about it this morning about, about truck driving and that, uh, the first truck driving job I got, I went and interviewed and did a test drive, drove the truck, and I ran home and, and was, uh, my dad called me and said, Hey, did you get the job? I said, yeah, I got, I got the job.
Well, what, what's it pay? I, I don't, I don't know. I dunno what I paid. I didn't care what it paid. I said, but I gotta drive this really cool Peterbilt, so you ought see this truck. You know? And so that's my, that's, that's where it came from. Uh. I, I would drive, I tell people I would drive for free. And to be honest, I, I, I feel like I, being an owner operator, I have driven for free.
There were times where, [00:06:00] where I wasn't making a bunch of money, but I, I, I love doing it. And, and I just, that's, that's my passion, so, yeah.
Riley: talk about that a little bit. 'cause you know, people who aren't familiar with how the industry works, um, myself included, for the most part. I, I understand some of it, but you said as an owner operator, you, you didn't make much money. Why? What's the structure look like? What's the, what happens
Todd Packer: Well. The, the profit margin in trucking is so small, and as you know, fuel prices and commodity prices go up and down. Uh, as far as just an independent guy, and I'm, I'm lucky 'cause I, I haven't really been an independent guy too often. I've been, uh, uh, I've been a common carrier for other carriers, so I've been able to lease my equipment onto somebody else that set up the loads and I was able to do that.
So I've been lucky in that, in that fact that I've been lucky to be with good companies. But as the economy has gone up and down, um, mo [00:07:00] mostly is just profit margin. Your fuel is 90% of, of what success is your fuel. It's 50% of what you make an owner operator is your of, of what you, um, what you spend is fuel.
So you take that right off the top and then your expenses as things go up and down and the economy changes, uh. The rates go up and down and, and fuel goes up. So I've had, you know, we, we down around 2000, what was it, 2007, 2008, when, when the, the economy crashed. That was a tough time. I was able to, to weather through that.
But it was tough. Uh, it was tough. I had to really, uh, you know, suck it up and, and like I say, there was a time there I wasn't making much money. But, um, as a, as a, as a owner operator with a lease to a company, you lease on your equipment to that company, uh, and you run on what they call their authority. So I was running on their authority.
Uh, they paid me for my [00:08:00] truck and the use of my truck and, and myself personally. But, um, and I, and there's some benefits with that. They, they lined up the loads, but you pay for that. You pay a, a fee, a percentage to that company for lining up your loads. Um, but if you get a company that, that has lots of loads, then that's, that's beneficial.
Then being an independent guy, whether you're out there chasing, you know, on the phone, trying to find loads, if that makes sense.
Riley: Yeah, so, so as an owner operator, what you're saying is most, most of the time you have to build your own network, your own customer base on who you would haul for. Is this, am I getting
Todd Packer: Right. As a, as a, if you're, if you're a hundred percent independent, then you are, you are out there. You may have, uh, your customers at U-Haul for that are your customers. And if you can get in with a company, a tractor company, say that, that that manufacturers tractors or tractor parts and you haul their parts and you go [00:09:00] out and get their load, you take it across the country, you drop it off and you find something to come back to load another load of their tractor parts.
Um, that's one way to do it. I, I went the other route. I leased onto a, a company that they had the loads and I did, I run everything through their dispatch
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: and so
Riley: so what that, what that means is as an independent driver, you are, not just driving a truck. You're, you're a salesman. You have to prospect, you have to get out there and find leads and
Todd Packer: absolutely.
Riley: you, you don't wanna take a load out one way and come back empty. Right.
Todd Packer: Oh, absolutely not. Absolutely not.
Riley: It's, uh, it's, it's really fascinating man, because it's, it's part of, you know, we, we take a trip somewhere and we see semi-truck all the time and, and don't give it a second thought on what that guy's life looks like. Right?
Todd Packer: Oh, and there's some, there was some dark, there was some dark times in that I, I made some [00:10:00] mistakes. Uh, uh, I, I had, I pulled reefers for a while. That was the refrigerated trailers. Uh, I owned the truck. I owned the trailer and was hauling other people's loads for a, for a company. I was, I was at leased onto 'em, and I picked up a load of chicken in Alabama and I'd been driving pretty hard and I was tired and I, I loaded a load of chicken.
And it was a refrigerator load. And the, i, I hauled it from, from Alabama to, to Idaho actually out there by your, your neck of the woods to wilder. And I got to wilder, opened up the doors, and the, the cool air just came rolling out. It's a hot day and the guy said, Hey, what, what's your temperature set at? I said, 10 below.
That's what they told me in to set my reefer at in Alabama. And he says, no, this is a fresh load. This is supposed to be 36 degrees. So I'd froze that load of chicken and. [00:11:00] And that was on me. That was on me. I had to, it did, I ended up going through my insurance and taking a big claim on it. But, but I, I ruined that whole load of chicken for that company.
I couldn't deliver that. And that was a, that was a big lesson that I learned. But as an independent guy, you take that, you take that on the, on the, on the, you know, that's what insurance is for, but your, your neck is really out there as far as as making mistakes. And, and so insurance, insurance was good, but still, then my rates went up and I paid for it.
The long run
Riley: So what's a load like that cost? Like what? What's the value of that
Todd Packer: mute.
Riley: you had to file an insurance claim?
Todd Packer: That load, that load. This was, gosh, this was probably 2008, 2009, and it was like $110,000 of chicken.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: Um, it was a straight load. Yeah. Yeah. It was a straight load of, of chicken breasts that [00:12:00] was strictly just chicken breasts that had been, uh, already pre-cut, sliced open, butterfly and open. So it was pretty high dollar.
It was actually the, the company was for, uh, I can say it, it was, it was Taco Bell that was, that was owned the chicken. So their standards are, are pretty strict as far as, there was nothing wrong with the chicken, but, but it wasn't meeting their specs on what they needed to do for their manufacturing. So they just said, sorry, it's, it's yours now.
So it was a dark day,
Riley: Oh
Todd Packer: but we got through it.
Riley: You, um, you and I went on a trip one time. Off the chicken subject, but you come and me along on a couple ride alongs over the years. It was a great time and
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: it was always good visit time, but one time we, we were hauling gas. It was a, if I remember right, it was CO2 gas, for another chicken plant, if I remember, I, at least a frozen foods outfit that they used it, I guess for flash freezing or something.
But[00:13:00]
Todd Packer: Yep,
Riley: what I didn't realize is that you had to fill your own tanker, which meant climbing up to the top of that thing, with these high pressure gases. Um, you know, you had to find a, a, uh, train car that was off the siding somewhere and go to that location or refill that haul
Todd Packer: that's right.
Riley: Right?
Todd Packer: That's right.
Riley: again, it's parts of the industry that would just. don't realize even exist. Right? I certainly did and I was really surprised by that. but there's some, some risk to that, right? You, you climb up on top of that train car and fall off that dang thing, or don't hook a connection upright and take high pressure gas to the face. Uh, that's a, can be a dangerous, dangerous stuff. So talk about that a little bit, man. What, what kind of things you guys face out there?
Todd Packer: That was,
Riley: I.
Todd Packer: that was the, that most of my career has been in the hazmat industry and I'm still currently in that industry hauling the gas. So we've branched out to lots of different gas as we do. What we do now [00:14:00] is all genic gas. So now I've kind of transitioned out of the driving aspect of, of, of the industry and I'm into the management side of it.
And so, uh, but we're still doing, uh, cryogenic ga, anything that's, is cryogenically cold. And, uh, so we're still, we're still doing that, but safety is huge. It's huge, uh, being safe. Uh, you know, it gets, it gets overlooked. And I joke about, about being safe, and I think sometimes we, uh, I don't know if you are a, a fan of Mike, but I'm a big micro fan,
Riley: that guy.
Todd Packer: but he talks about, about being overly safe and sometimes you can be too face or too safe and productivity slows down.
And I agree with that to a point. But safety is, is paramount. Um, you know, and now I. Now as, as a manager, I have to take care of my guys. And so I, I preach to 'em about safety all the time. So, and, and training. We do [00:15:00] lots of training. We we're constantly training and, and updating and then going back and relearning the stuff that we already know.
We all should know it already, but, uh, when it comes to trucking safety is, is, is paramount, especially with what I do. I mean with, with the industry that I've kind of, my niche is as far as hazmat and, um, maybe other, all safety is important in all trucking, but it's definitely a huge part of what I do now, if that makes sense.
Riley: the hazmat, uh, when you're talking about, is it, uh, toxic stuff or is it more just dangerous because it's cryo?
Todd Packer: Uh, both, both. Uh, we do, we do lots of, uh, of, of stuff that's, um, I can't say a whole lot. About some of the stuff that we haul because it's, we we're a common carrier for, for a big, a big, uh, gas company that everybody knows. And so I don't want to get in trouble and say too much about what we haul and where we haul it too.
But, uh, we do haul a lot of [00:16:00] toxic, uh, dangerous, a lot of the stuff that we haul, uh, as placarded, uh, dangerous, uh, poisonous, uh, the pressure itself is dangerous, but then we haul, you know, even some, some, uh, I can't say, but, um, we haul some pretty nasty, some pretty nasty stuff. That inhalation hazard, if you breathe it in, um, you can't, you can't, you can't breathe it in.
So you have to make sure that, you know, you take all the precautions and securement and the handling of it so that you don't get a, a face, a face full of it. And some, some of the things we do, we have to have respirators and, and lots of precautions on, on doing that. So.
Riley: that's really interesting, man. 'cause you're. Again, that's something that we don't think about all the time. We see these little placards on the back of a trailer and we just drive by and it says, you know, hazmat says flammable, this kinda stuff on there. But we don't realize that the driver had some pretty direct, um, direct [00:17:00] contact potentially with those chemicals and, and whatever's on board there. Um, like I said, that surprised me when we went out and, and I saw how involved you were about having to be educated to actually fill truck off that train car. me, I was just like, man, I didn't even know this was a thing this is stuff you've gotta know.
Todd Packer: I.
Riley: there was certain connections and certain, uh, order of operation to do that with.
And again, you know, dealing with climbing up on top of these machines and impression stuff was, to me that was new and uh, had no idea that drivers dealt with that kind of stuff.
Todd Packer: Funny thing about that, that now that you're, that you made, you remember that is we took that out to the same chicken plant that I froze that load of chicken. That was the same,
Riley: place.
Todd Packer: that was the same, same place that 10 years earlier, I'd, I'd, that's where I delivered that chicken load to and froze it. And then that's where me and you went is outta that same place and delivered, delivered the [00:18:00] carbon dioxide for the flash freezing of it.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: So rather than, rather than having them store it in their freezer, they can run it right across the, uh, the, uh, manufacturing line, freeze it, and box it and ship it. Then, you know, within an hour rather than manufacturing it, storing it, and, and taking up storage space. So that's, that's the, that's the, you know, CO2 is used for everything, but, um, but that's a, that's what, that's what that place was using it for.
Riley: That's it. That super. I remember. So, so I remember another time we did a, we did a run and you, we went somewhere in, in, uh, Eastern Oregon and we picked up a load of onions, right? And
Todd Packer: Yep. Yep.
Riley: it was kind of winter time. It wasn't, wasn't super cold outside, but it was kind of in the freezing part of the year. And I remember being surprised 'cause you, was a cover on the onions, but you had it open on the side so the air could flow through it to prevent freezing.[00:19:00]
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: And. Again, these are things that I didn't realize that, that you were responsible for. We're, we're in this, like, I can't remember how, what, we had 50 something thousand pounds of onions on this truck.
Right. And again, don't remember where you were taking them, but I remember being kind of caught off guard with that. Like, oh man, you've, you've gotta, gotta keep the things open so that the, the air doesn't get stagnant. It keeps, keeps some of them from freezing again. That was caught kind of awe inspiring to me because I, one, I kind of learned something about moving air and how that all physics worked. But then, um. There was that kind of, kind of realization that Todd's gotta know what the crap he's doing here. And, and then in addition to that, there was, you were discussing with me like weight distribution and how, how you had to dictate how that load was put on that trailer to the guys at the plant that we're loading it.
You know, it's like, it's gotta be in this zone 'cause this is the [00:20:00] weight of my truck and we gotta have axle weights all line up for, know, weighing in at the way stations and, you know, all that kind of stuff you were talking about was fascinating to me. I'm just talk about that stuff a little bit, man.
Like all the different regulation you have to deal with.
Todd Packer: You know, there's a little bit of math, there's a little bit of math involved with, with, with driving truck. I never thought I was not that really good at math, but there's a little bit of math involved in, in, um, in truck driving that you gotta keep, you gotta keep straight. Um, and then like what you're talking about, uh, on, on produce is.
And, and I don't know how, I don't even know how that works, but I know that if, if you, if, if you have air moving through a product, it won't freeze as long as the air is moving through those onions. Uh, even cold air, it won't freeze. I know that, uh, in Potato Cellars in Idaho, they're the same process. They, they run ventilation through there, and so they can store those potatoes in, you know, cold, [00:21:00] cold temperatures in Idaho, well below freezing, but they keep air circulating through the, the cellars and they don't freeze.
Somehow that you would think that blast and cold air on something would, would freeze it. But, uh, it's the opposite. It keeps them from freezing. So, um, on my, on my hazmat side, I, I'm fascinated. Myself personally, by the cryogenic industry, I am just, it's science and I love being involved in, in science. Um, I've had the opportunity to, um, work with, uh, United Launch Alliance.
I don't know if you've ever heard of United Launch Alliance, but they launch all the rockets for, they're a contractor to nasa. Uh, NASA doesn't launch their own rockets. They hire contractors to, to launch their rockets. And there's a company called United Launch Alliance. And I, I worked for about three years on a, on a, on a big missile project.
It was a [00:22:00] Delta four project. And so, um, we launched the biggest, uh, rocket that's ever gone in, into outer space. It's called the delta, the delta four Heavy. And so, which all rocket? All, all my part was, is hauling nitrogen or hydrogen. And oxygen. That's all rocket fuel is, is there's no, there's no, um. Yeah, there's no, uh, magic to it.
They just ox uh, hydrogen oxygen, light it on fire, run it through a nozzle and, and up the rocket goes. So it was, but it was fascinating to be involved in that and just cryogenic the vacuum. Our trailers are all vacuum sealed and understand that that vacuum, uh, your, your windows at your house have a vacuum on 'em.
It's the same principle In order to keep that product that a lot of times our product we haul are, are, you know, a couple hundred degrees below zero, like, um, nitrogen and oxygen or oxygen are, are [00:23:00] well below 200 degrees below zero. In order to keep that, you have to have a vacuum around your, your trailer.
Uh, so there's a double walled trailer that you see going down the road, but there's a vacuum between that. Just like your windows on your house have a vacuum. The perfect vacuum is. Is the best insulation that you can have
Riley: Right.
Todd Packer: is just nowhere, which is no molecules to bump into each other as long as this.
They suck basically all the air outta the trailers. And there's, there's very little, there's never no such thing as a, as a perfect vacuum on earth. The only perfect vacuum is in outer space. That's the only perfect vacuum. We can't duplicate that, uh, on, on earth. So, but it's interesting to me that that's how we do it.
We, we create outer space as much as we can inside the trailers to keep the, the molecules from, from, from balancing together to create heat. As long as [00:24:00] they're not. Bouncing together, then that's, it's a good insulation and that's what we use in the, in my industry as insulation is, is vacuum. That's interesting to me.
I, I learned that, um, there's no such thing as, as cold. There's no such thing on earth as cold. There's just heat and lack of heat. There's no, there's, there's a perfect vacuum, which is perfectly cold, which is no heat. And then there is gone, the, on the opposite spectrum is, is nuclear fusion, and that's the opposite.
There's a perfect, there's outer space and there's nuclear fusion and everything in between. So, um, but I've, I've really enjoyed learning about how that works and, and how it pertains to my job. And if you lose your vacuum, then your product gets warm and it vents and you don't want, you don't want it to vent.
That's a bad thing. So, um,
Riley: So this
Todd Packer: it's interesting to me.
Riley: thing, right? So you've got these, these [00:25:00] super cold gases that are condensed down often into a liquid, right? And then if that warms up, then those expand. And so when you say vents, that's a safety valve that goes off and just basically empties the
Todd Packer: It is. It is, it is. And you know, you'll see what I, 90% of what I do is, is, is hauling out of, uh, what they call air separators. And that's all it is. It's just, you'll see 'em, you'll see 'em, uh, you'll see 'em when you drive down the road. There's these big square boxes that are up in the sky. And there's just a big, it's a big air call of it.
All they're doing is sucking their, the air out of the sky, and they cool it, and they separate it. Every, every, every molecule of air will turn into a liquid at some temperature.
Riley: Sure.
Todd Packer: they just cool it and they circulate that air and as it, as it cools. And as soon as that, that oxygen cools at a certain [00:26:00] temperature, turns into a liquid, as soon as it turns into a liquid, they store it in this tank, uh, nitrogen turns into a liquid at a certain temperature.
As soon as it hits that temperature off, it goes into its tank. And as. All the air is cooled, it's separated into liquids, but they get it right out of the air that we breathe. So, you know, it's, it's kind of a misnomer that we breathe oxygen to breathe and we do need oxygen to breathe, but, but we need nitrogen.
We 90, or most of what we breathe is, is straight nitrogen. Yes, we have to have oxygen, but what we, what we're breathing is more nitrogen than it is oxygen. And then we're breathing it all. But that's what the air's made out of. But that's, that's it in a nutshell as far as cryogenic gases is we just suck it out of the sky and, and cool it down until it turns into a liquid and then we put it in a tank and take it somewhere. In essence.
Riley: That is fascinating, man. I, got me curious. Now I'd like to learn more about Azar [00:27:00] Separators.
Riley: That's a, it's basically the same
Todd Packer: It's pretty cool
Riley: fuel, right? But they're just doing it with air.
Todd Packer: doing it there. And [00:28:00] now what I do, what I specialize in now is, uh, some of these places that mix these gases together to make certain gases. For, for industries, uh, mostly what I use is what they call electronic gas. And so electronic gas is what the micro customers are on semiconductor, uh, micron there in Boise, um, Texas instruments.
These people that make, that make, uh, computer chips. So mostly what I do, um, is, is supply the gases, you know, haul the gases for the suppliers. I don't make the gas. I don't manufacture the gas. Um, our company just. Ships it to the places that need it to for manufacturing. But it's mostly what I deal with as far as the, the man, the trucks that I manage are, are delivering that to, uh, semiconductors for what they call electronic gas.
And that's mixtures. They'll take all kinds of these gases and mix 'em together. [00:29:00] And, uh, it's pretty interesting to me 'cause it makes 'em kind of unstable and, uh, some of these gases were, are fine in a cylinder that's upright, but if you turn the cylinder sideways and they mix, then it causes a reaction. So you gotta make sure that everything stays in a line.
And I don't, I, I, I nerd out on, on this kind of stuff. I know I'm a truck driver, but I really nerd out on the, uh, the cryogenic stuff.
Riley: So that, that kind of stuff to me. It's so dang fascinating, man. I, I could, I could just go on with this conversation all day, um, to the, to the, maybe the boredom of my, of my audience. But I tell you what, it's pretty dang fascinating to me. Um, well talk about this, man. How many, how many trucks do you manage today?
A.
Todd Packer: Well, our trucks do. The trucks that I manage, I work for a company, I'm not gonna say the company, but I work for a [00:30:00] company that we have as a company. We have about 130 trucks on the road. I manage a portion of those trucks doing, um, the electronic gas. And we have runs that kind of cover the whole country.
So, uh, probably 30 drivers total. That are under my control, that, that, I just gotta make sure it's, it's, it's nothing to it. I just gotta make sure that they're where they need to be, when they need to, when to be there, and if they have a breakdown or, or safety issues or, um, kind of a liaison with the companies at, you know, if there's a problem with deliveries and then I'm the guy that they call for, uh, I just put out fires basically, is all I do.
Riley: The firefighter of the, so. So what's that look like, man, when you're, I, I just am curious what a day-to-day looks like. 'cause you're, you're talking 130 trucks. [00:31:00] Um, we call 'em 18 wheelers for a reason. That's a lot of tires. That's a lot of fuel, that's a lot of mechanical repairs. do you manage all of that?
Todd Packer: I do now, let me, oh, I've got, we've got, we've got people that, that if we have a breakdown or a tires that we have outside, we have a local mechanics and then we have, uh, outside mechanics, uh, outside, uh, I guess they'd be, uh, I don't know what's, I'm, I'm a miss on the name, but they, they schedule, you know, if a truck breaks down on the road, they're gonna find a shop and get in the shop.
Um, the driver usually calls me and says, Hey Todd, I've got, I've got this going on. And then I'll instruct them to call whoever to fix whatever they need done. So, um, I just kind of heard 'em, but, um, it's funny because you've heard of the 80 you've heard of the law of the 80 20 law. Have you ever heard of the 80 20 law.[00:32:00]
It is, it is the same with with me trucking as, as in any industry. I've got, um, 80% of my work is caused by 20% of my guys. I've got, you know, 20% of my guys call me for, for everything. You know what I mean? Just nonsense and takes up a lot of my time. And then the another 80% I don't hear from, and I've gotta call them and be like, Hey man, you guys okay?
You need anything? You're good. Yeah, Todd, we're good. So, but then I've got guys that call me that to ask me if they can stop for lunch. You know? I mean, it's just ridiculous, you know what I mean?
Riley: It's like,
Todd Packer: I'm being, I'm exaggerating a little bit, but Yeah. Yeah. Dude, what are you calling me for? What do you, you, you don't need to call me for that.
Don't bog me. But
Riley: So talk
Todd Packer: that's how it is. But
Riley: from a manager standpoint,
Todd Packer: I.
Riley: You're, you've got these guys who, of 'em are just higher maintenance than others. How do [00:33:00] you, how do you gracefully
Todd Packer: struggle.
Riley: without getting sarcastic, man?
Todd Packer: Well, let me, let me tell you. I didn't, I didn't, I, I, I'm the, I'm a manager and I, I didn't ask to be the manager. Okay? So I, I've worked my way into this position as, as a manager of trucks. Um, mostly because of my experience, not because I, I, I, I didn't apply for this job. I, it just kind of, it just kind of grew into it.
Okay? So I. I struggle. I'm not, I don't think I'm a good manager because I expect everybody to do what do it the way I do it. I've had to really retrain myself to, to be like, Hey, every driver's different. Everybody does it different. Um, I've got the way I do it, I think it's hard for somebody who comes from a driver standpoint to be then [00:34:00] become a manager because I have a little experience on, on, I know how it should be done in my eyes, so I expect these guys just to do it.
The way I do it. And I tell 'em, you know, the way I think they should do it. And then they don't do it that way. And I get, I used to get really frustrated because I'm like, gosh, why? Why is he not just doing it the way I told him? Just do it the way I tell you and it'll be fine. But I realize that my way isn't the only way.
It's, it's my way. And I've got, I struggle with personalities because, um, I owned, I owned a lot of trucks there for a while, and I would wanna hire guys that are just like me. I wanted friends. I wanted to hire people that I got along with and, and could I, I, I like to have fun. I like to joke around and, and, and I would hire these guys and, and I, I realized quickly that you can't do [00:35:00] that.
You just need to, you just need to hire guys that can get the job done. You may not like them, you may not like their personality, you may not get along with them, but I've got guys that I don't necessarily get along with, but they do a really good job. They do a great job. So I've had to, yeah,
Riley: you,
Todd Packer: to train myself to just be like, Hey, that's, that's what they do.
Riley: you just said something there that I think is so stinking wise because, uh, you know, and, and managers and business owners in general need to need to hear it. 'cause it's a struggle, it's a pain point for everyone in those positions, right? Is that there's a job that needs to be done. They're people are gonna do it different than you would, long as the end result comes along, that's, that's
Todd Packer: Absolutely
Riley: Don't worry your little head about it. Right. Just it happen.
Todd Packer: Yep. Yep. That's tough for some people. I think some people that really are, are better at it than I am. [00:36:00] 'cause I just, I just want it to be done the way I do it.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: But
Riley: Well, so.
Todd Packer: it gets done and I'm, and I've learned to kind of, kind of step, take a step back and let, let them, I tell, and I tell my drivers now, Hey, you, you, it's, you drive the ship.
It's yours. You, that's yours, how you do it, as long as you're doing it safe and on time. That's the beauty of trucking. There's a freedom involved in that. And so. Uh, I just let 'em, let 'em have it, let 'em, let 'em do their thing. And then if they, if they're unsafe or they, they're doing something that's, that I need to step in and, and counsel them, then that's part of my job.
But if they, as long as they're getting it done, then I, I kind of take hands off as much as I can.
Riley: Do. Do you have a story that stands out where somebody just come in and you really struggled with the way they did something, but at the end you had to kind of just admit that, yeah, shit. It's okay. They can do that. You [00:37:00] know? Do you have one of those that stands
Todd Packer: Yeah. Uh, I had a guy, I, maybe this is, I don't know if this is where this is, this is the, uh, pertaining to this, but I had a guy that, uh, was, was a storyteller. If somebody said they, uh. You know, he was a one-up. You know what I mean? He'd done it all, he'd done it, he'd done it all, you know what I mean? He'd, he'd driven every kind of truck he could drive up every mountain.
He, you know, he just, he just, you know, it was just a, uh, a story tell. And I didn't believe 90, if, if he did everything he said he did, he'd be 200 years old. You know what I mean? There's no way. But I, I, he frustrated the heck outta me. I just was like, oh, this guy, he drives me nuts. Um, and then I changed the way I dealt with him.
I changed my, instead of, instead of of of not wanting to talk to him, I had, I started to ask him questions, you know what I mean? I [00:38:00] wanted him to tell me these crazy stories, you know, and, and I just changed how I treated him and my, my, uh, attitude towards him. And, and I, we ended up being, you know, I, I kinda understood him and just like, this guy's just crazy pants and he just needs to talk and let him talk.
He and he did a good job. He did a good job. But, um, I had to, I had to change in my head how I dealt with him, if that makes sense. And, and it ended up just how I kinda had fun with it. I kinda had fun with him, you know, he doesn't work here anymore, but, um, I ended up really having fun and, and would look forward to being around him just to hear the craziness, you know what I mean?
So I don't know if that's where you
Riley: No, no, it's, it's, it's
Todd Packer: to say.
Riley: works 'cause I, I've known people that way too. You know, the one upper, I love that you give it that title. 'cause that's, that's a real thing you're just like. Yeah. And yeah, you'd have to be 200
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: to be, [00:39:00] to have done all the
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: Right.
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: or at least claimed to have done. So when you're talking about this guy and you changed your perspective, uh, as far as how you interacted with him, where did the idea come from?
Was that something you, you read up upon, you studied, you asked for someone else for advice, and where'd that come from?
Todd Packer: Just, I just, I, I, I don't, I don't know. I know that's kind of a bad answer, but I don't remember what, what, what flipped the trigger. But I think I just realized in my head, I have to figure out a way to deal with this. You know? 'cause it was driving me crazy and I have to, I had to just, how am I gonna be around this guy?
And it just kind of, it was pretty, I think it was kind of organic on how it, it came about. It just kinda happened. But, um, I, I had to, I had to change something or I was going to, you know, go crazy. And I think a lot of it with, with truck drivers [00:40:00] too, is they're probably lonely. You know? I like being alone.
I love people. I'm a people person, but I'm fine with being alone for days. Um, so, and I, I think I need it. And I think a lot of truck drivers, some of 'em are that way. And then some of 'em don't like being alone. So when they get near people, they. They just let it all out. They just gotta, you know, throw up everything that they need on onto you.
You know what I mean? And so I think that's what this guy was. He was just lonely and he was a single guy and, and, uh, just had a lot of, a lot of stuff to talk about.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: And he wanted you to like him. He did. He wanted you to like him, and he wanted to be your friend. And he, you know, he just wanted to, to, to share what he had.
You know what I mean?
Riley: Yeah, I think we all do that to a point, right? You'll be, you meet somebody and you're talking to them, realize they're into a certain hobby or this kind of thing, and we're gonna bring up the thing that is [00:41:00] closest to that and kind of have something in common to talk about. But, you know, we've all been around those
Todd Packer: Right, right,
Riley: been around, those people who are like, man, I, I got nothing.
Todd Packer: right,
Riley: I really wanna have something in common with you, but I got nothing.
Todd Packer: right. Right.
Riley: Um.
Todd Packer: I, and I, I try to do that. I do, I try to do that, you know, um, I think that's part of, of, of, not necessarily being a manager, but just people, people as a whole. You know, I try to find common ground with anybody. If you don't, if you, if, if you don't have a lot in common with them, there's, there's gotta be something.
And if you can find that, then it, a lot of times your relationship will change with that person if you have just one thing that, um, you can talk about with that person. And I think people want to be heard. And I, I've got, and I, I talk about that with people. I've got a couple drivers that just, they call me for a lot of, of [00:42:00] just nitpick stuff or, or nonsense.
And I think it's just, they need to be, they wanna be heard, they want, they want somebody to acknowledge that they're doing their job, that they, because I think it is lonely sometimes out on the road. And so I think, I think people as, as human beings, we just wanna be heard. And um, I think that's where a lot of it comes from.
Riley: You as you're kind of watching this happen? 'cause you, you, you mentioned liking to be alone, but then also mentioned lonely and then two different things. Right? You can you talk about that a little bit
Todd Packer: As far as, as far as what? Ri like
Riley: just
Todd Packer: don't be difference between being a
Riley: like, right? Because you, you get, you, you talked about these guys calling you for this, some nitpicky kind of almost ridiculous. Can I go to lunch sort of a thing. Um,
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: because they, they're out there starving. For some people attention. That's lonely. That's a
Todd Packer: Well,
Riley: thing [00:43:00] than, than
Todd Packer: that is lonely.
Riley: some
Todd Packer: That is.
Riley: Right.
Todd Packer: That is, and, and I think it's getting, it's getting with the way that communication works nowadays, um, we have satellites communications in all of our trucks. And so the driver is, can go a driver and our company's more, uh, hands-on. We, we talk, we call our guys, Hey, you know, we check in with them.
Um, we, we, it's, it's not, you're not a, you're not a number here. You're not just a truck number. There's these big, big companies where these guys will go, these guys will go weeks, months, without ever speaking to anybody that works for 'em. And we don't do that. So I think those guys, you know, everything's done through the computer in the truck, the onboard computer that they send messages back and forth.
We've all got, all of our trucks have got basically, uh, tablets in them. You know, that we [00:44:00] send all our communication, everything's done through that. And so they can, they can, they don't have to talk to us. And some, some guys like that. Um, I, I'm the type of guy that I just wanted to do my job. I didn't wanna, I don't, I didn't wanna less hands off.
Let's just let me go do my thing, you know? I like that. But, um, I. I, I'm, I'm a people person, so when I'm around people, I, I like to interact and, and socialize, but I, again, I'm okay with my personality. I'm okay with, with going out for a week at a time, um, and not talking to anybody, period. Just, just being alone.
Um, I, and I, I actually need that and I struggle with that. Now. That's a little bit what we can talk, what we'll talk about with, with, with my motorcycle stuff is, is as I'm not driving truck, I need that re that escape, [00:45:00] uh, driving truck was my escape from, uh, I, I tell people, I, I solve all the world's problems.
When I was driving truck, I had all day long just to, to think. Which is, which is good and it's bad. It's, it's, it's, it's, uh, it's a double-edged sword because you, if you have a problem that you're working on, uh, me personally, and I was driving, I had time to figure it out, to sort it out in my head, figure out a plan, go over pros and cons and, and, and how this would work out.
Um, and I could usually solve that problem. The bad thing is about it is if you can't solve the problem, if it's a problem that you can't solve, then you're stuck. You're stuck in it. You've got, you know, 11 hours of driving the windshield time where you just, you just, uh, it can, it can drive you crazy if you can't solve the problem and you're thinking about it, it's, and you can't escape [00:46:00] from any other distraction.
You can't distract yourself. It's just you and your thoughts. Then that can be, it can be, um, uh, excruciating. Mentally.
Riley: I hear you man. Some of my best ideas come when I'm on a long road trip, man. I got 12 hour
Todd Packer: Yes.
Riley: and man, I get four hours into that thing and all of a sudden the ideas just start. And some of 'em are
Todd Packer: Yes.
Riley: some 'em aren't.
Todd Packer: Right, right, right,
Riley: uh, this podcast came actually from that. I was on a, a 20 hours driving from Dallas to back to Boise, and I had been down there for this. Conference with a whole bunch of people that I just really look up to, kinda I've known over the years from a distance and got to meet in person and, and I was like, man, I'm meeting so many of these really cool people that have had some kind of outside influence in my life, and now I have a direct connection to them. Like, why would I not do a podcast and interview these [00:47:00] guys and pick their brains on
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: And so yeah, that's where that came from was windshield time. Man. So I, I hear you on that.
Todd Packer: Yep.
Riley: Um, talk about this a little bit. So you had the phrase, you never know li where life is gonna take you, um, earlier in the podcast, and one of those things happened you were driving truck for a long time.
One of the, kind of the that happens often with truck drivers is they gain a lot of weight, right? And.
Todd Packer: Absolutely. It's horrible.
Riley: Well, so talk about what that looks like first, and I want to talk about when you fell and, and broke your leg, and I wanna kind of segue into that.
Todd Packer: Okay. So, yeah, I, I, uh, to go clear back, I was, I was, I did a few years in the Marine Corps and I come outta the Marine Corps in probably the best shape of my life. And, um, I was healthy, I was strong, and I transitioned into driving [00:48:00] truck and I, it's, it's the best probably, I think. I don't know of any other profession that can be worse than driving a truck as far as your diet.
Um, back in the day, uh, there used to be, uh, when I first started driving, there was, uh, sit down restaurants at every truck stop, you know, that you'd, you'd, you'd drive, you'd get out, get done with your day, you'd go in, uh, you were tired, you would sit down. And this was before cell phones, so, um, we all had 800 numbers.
At our houses, you would just, it's just like, uh, uh, a Verizon phone plan. Now, you would, every phone company had a, uh, uh, uh, an option to have an 800 number that you could, you could set up your house to where you could call home and talk to your wife, loved ones, and, uh, reduce, reduce cost. So you would go in, I don't know if you remember, a lot of people probably don't at truck stops all had [00:49:00] telephones at the table and, you know, corded telephones at the table.
You would sit down at the table and you would order ESM dinner and you would call your wife and you would talk to your wife while you were having dinner. And there'd be, you know, 15 truck drivers all sitting at their tables with, with their, just like we do now, uh, with our phones in our ear, talking to your, talking to your family.
Um, and then you would, you would hang up and go out and go to bed. Um, so that, that was probably more healthy than the way it is now. 'cause as I started driving the transition to, they've taken out the, uh, the sit down restaurants and putting in taco bells and, uh, Wendy's. And now, you know, now you're, you can just wheel in and grab a greasy hamburger and some french fries and a milkshake and, and, and go out and you're driving 11 hours a day.
Back when I first started driving, we had, we could only drive 10 hours. Now we've upped that to 11. [00:50:00] Uh, there's some rule changes that have made it to where you can drive up to 11 now you gonna take a little longer break, but. Still, you're just, you're just eating and it, and then you're tired. So what do you do?
What do you do when you're tired? Uh, I'm guilty of it. Last night I woke up at about 11 o'clock last night in New Jersey. I had to do a run because one of my drivers had, his wife had, uh, surgery as emergency surgery, so I had to go trucking and do his run up to Boston. So, um, when I woke up in New Jersey last night, about 10 o'clock and drove all night, I haven't, I haven't been to bed yet.
Um, and so, uh. You're tired and what do you, what if you want a snack. So the way I avoid it now is I just don't buy it. I don't buy it. It's not in the truck. And so if it's not in my truck, I don't eat it. But that, but back in the day, I would, I would just buy some bag of chips and, and, and I was, I was [00:51:00] thin.
So it just gradually, you know, month by month by month by year. And then I, you know, I just got hell unhealthy and, and, and more unhealthy. And more unhealthy. And then as you get up unhealthy, you, your energy level goes down. And, and I woke up one day and, and that did cause my, uh, did cause my accident. I was, I, I was doing some heavy haul, if you want me to get into the, into that.
What happened there? But I was, I was around 300 and, and, uh, like 10 pounds. And I was, uh, haul heavy equipment back then. And I had a big dozer on the back of my truck and I stepped out and it was, it was about 10 feet high, big, uh, D 11 n, which is about as big a dozer as they make it was going to a mine.
And I tripped. I tripped and coming outta the cab and, and fell out and landed right [00:52:00] on my heels, um, on my feet. But at 310 pounds, um, that's a lot of weight to support on your, on your, uh, tibia and fibia. And, uh, I just crushed 'em. They just, they didn't break. They just, they broke in about 25 pieces, just little tiny pieces in my,
Riley: really?
Todd Packer: in your leg.
And it just shattered, shattered the, the both tibia and fibia. So, um, um. You would think that, you know, I was off work there for about a year. Didn't, didn't, didn't drive, was in a wheelchair for a long time. And, um, that was, that was, that was hard. And then I had to, um, basically, you know, you, you had, I had bad, uh, um, and I actually, during this process, I lost a lot of weight.
Um, I, I made it a goal during that time to lose, to lose some weight. So I lost weight during, you know, during the, [00:53:00] the heel process.
Riley: How
Todd Packer: And my, my legs was that,
Riley: How much do you remember?
Todd Packer: not, not a ton. Maybe 50 pounds. Maybe 50 pounds.
Riley: just 50
Todd Packer: I wasn't ex Yeah, not a ton. I was exerci. I wasn't exercising. So I wasn't, you know, I was just dieting, just eating less and, and cooking at home. And, and that was a lot easier to, to eat healthy at home. Um, and my, my muscles atrophied. My legs just, I had little girl legs.
They were just little tiny, you know. Legs and I was a big guy and so that was, I had to, I had to strengthen my muscles back up when I went back to work. So it was a, it was a slog, but, um, went right back to, went right back to driving and, um, my diet was still bad and, and I put the weight, I put the weight back on.
So, um, I guess it's such, and now, [00:54:00] uh, I'm not gonna throw my son under the bus 'cause he's, he's healthy and, and in, and in pretty good shape. But I see how he's eating. And, and I'm telling him, Cade, and you just gotta, you gotta change it now because I don't want you to end up like I did. And he's got the, you know, he doesn't think it's, you know, he's, he's in good shape, so he's like, uh, but his eating health, his eating habits aren't, aren't good.
And we talk about it all the time and he knows what he's gotta do and we talk about it, but it's, it's just, it's such an unhealthy lifestyle. That being said, there's guys out there that, that do drive trucks that manage it very well. I just manage it poorly and 90% of us manage it poorly because of the, the, the food options that we have.
But, um, the truck stops are getting better at, at options, you know, but, uh, I think maybe I'm [00:55:00] talking too much Riley, but, uh, during COID is when I really saw, I was driving full time during COVID. That was kind of the beginning for me is COVID because, uh, everything shut down. So we, I would pack my own food, I'd cook food, put it in my truck, and you couldn't just stop at a truck stop.
All the restaurants were closed and I started eating better then when you didn't have the options. And so that was kind of the start of my, you know, weight loss is, is during COVID, believe it or not. So I guess, I guess if anything good came outta that, maybe that's it.
Riley: Yeah,
Todd Packer: I can't say much, but that was good.
Riley: so, so talk about this man. 'cause you're, you're, um, you had talked to me here, gosh, probably a year ago now, about this, about hiking, uh, I wanna call it trekking, right? Because that's kinda what you do. And,
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: a, it's a pretty, pretty cool [00:56:00] thing you've done hiking some of the, like the Appalachian Trail and some different things, uh, different long stretches of that.
Um, can you, can you talk about that a little bit? That was pretty cool to me.
Todd Packer: Well, well, so it's that, that, that's a whole, that's a whole discussion. Um, I, and it all goes back to energy and I realize that [00:57:00] food is energy and if you eat the right foods, then your ma your, you have energy. So I had all this energy, uh, newfound energy, like I was saying earlier about, you know, you eat bad food and you didn't want it, you gained weight and you would, you would, you just had no energy.
I didn't have any energy to, to exercise or, or do anything. So you start putting the right fuel into your body and, and it, and food is fuel. Fuels us and gives us energy. And once I had all this energy, I, I, I wanted to do something with it. So, uh, it's kind of a dual thing. So, um, maybe I'm gonna embarrass myself a little bit, but I am a prepper, so I, um, I don't think that there's gonna be a zombie apocalypse or anything like that, but I have seen probably through COVID, and that's kind of when it started, is out here.
Everything just shut down. The stores shut down. Um, everything, just, everything [00:58:00] just, you couldn't get, you couldn't get what you needed here. Uh, there's a lot of people here and, and the grocery stores were chaotic. And I said, uh, during that time I said, never again am I gonna, um, be worried about that. So I started to, um, uh.
Prepare myself and my family and storing, you know, uh, enough food for, for myself and my wife's family and our kids and, um, getting supplies, even camping supplies and stuff like that. And so that's where that happened. And one thing about it was I thought if. And let me, let me, let me tell you this. Me and my wife were, um, were in a snowstorm on I 95.
We were trucking together one night, and this is how, this is how it all started, is we, um, I'd been prepping a little bit and when I always carried extra supplies in my truck, I had, um, res, [00:59:00] I had a case of res in my truck. I had some blankets, some candles. Um, I had a actual backpack that, uh, I could put on if I needed to and, and, and, and, and walk home, you know.
And so we were, um, but I physically, I wasn't in shape to do that. I had this stuff, but physically, I, I wouldn't have been able to walk home. So, uh, we got stuck up on I 95 during the snow apocalypse or whatever they called it, and we sat up there for three days on the interstate. Um, and we were fine. We were fine, we were fine.
I had a, a semi-truck full of fuel. Uh, in fact, you know, people were. Coming to our truck. Uh, we had food. We were, we were handing out food, we were handing out blankets. We were letting people just get in our truck and stay warm. We had a gal that was in a, like a RV that was almost outta gas, and she was traveling for a job up in, [01:00:00] uh, Massachusetts and one of those sprinter vans.
And she's like, I, I, I'm freezing. I don't have any more diesel. If I run it anymore, I'm gonna, it's going to not get me outta here. And a lot of cars did. Once, once it was all, you know, traffic started moving. Half the cars were outta gas, but she, um, she spent the night in our truck. Just staying warm. We weren't sleeping, we were all just kinda, uh, dozing off.
But it was a little uncomfortable for us and my, my wife and, and her. But we, we stayed warm and, and, um, a lot of people thanked us for, uh, had phone calls the next morning. Um, that guys are a couple ladies that were stuck out there with their kids, that their husbands wanted to talk to us and thank us for, for giving their families food.
And so, but during that, we were talking, I said, um, if we had to walk home from here, could we walk home? Could we do it? Could I physically, we've got this stuff. Could I [01:01:00] physically walk home? And that I was no way could I walk. We were about, you know, 120 miles away from home. We weren't far away from home, so.
I decided that time that I was going to get in shape to where if I had to walk home from anywhere, I could walk home. And that's what started it. So I would get, uh, I would road walk. At first I would just get my backpack and we would go out and my wife would drive us out 30 miles and just on the road and just drop me off.
And, um, we'd walk home. I was doing it with her kids too, and it was kind of fun. It bonds us together, but we would just walk as far as we could and sleep in people's backyards and, you know, duck out into the woods kind of stealth camping or, or whatever you call it. But, um, and that's what started it as we started walking and started walking with packs.
Um, and I started figuring out gear and becoming kind of a [01:02:00] gear head when it comes to lighter gear. Man, that first time I did it, I had, I think my pack weighed 50, 50 pounds and I learned real fast that that ain't gonna work. You know what I mean? That ain't gonna work. So, um, I, you know, I kind of went down that rabbit hole and started to, to, to invest in, in better gear.
And then once we got, you know, done with that stuff, I'm like, all right, let's go. We got the stuff, let's go hiking. So I, I sort of w hiking. North Carolina's great for that. We have lots of of trails. We have the Appalachian Trail that comes through. We also have a trail that's kind of attached to the, uh, Appalachian trail that goes to the ocean.
They call it the Mountain to sea trail. So I can, I can go out on a, on a Friday night and get dropped off and walk, you know, walk as far as I can and then just camp out. And, and I, my wife, my wife doesn't love it [01:03:00] near as much as I do. But, um, she got out a couple times, but I'll just go as far and then call her in a couple days and say, this is where I'm at.
And she'll come and she'll come and pick me up and, and bring me home. But, um, there's lots of good hiking, but that's how it started, to be honest.
Riley: That is super cool, man. And then you've taken that from, from this, uh, hiking, trekking, and you've added adventure bikes into it too now. So adventure bikes for you guys who don't know is a, um, a dirt bike with some storage capacity on them that, uh, yeah, it's just a, it's a motorcycle and you can go just about anywhere in the dang things.
And they're powerful enough generally to travel highway speeds if you get on highways, but they're also very, um, off-road worthy. So as you're in the back country, you can still maneuver around and, uh, talk about that a little bit.
Todd Packer: Well, they're, uh, as far as the adventure bikes, they're horrible. They're horrible bikes. They're not, they're not good at, they're not good at anything. [01:04:00] Um, uh, they're not good dirt. They're not good dirt bikes, and they're not good road bikes, but they do both of 'em. Fair. You know what I mean? So I've got, I've got some, I've got bikes that are really good on the road now that I've went down this journey and I've got straight up dirt bikes that are super capable in, in the, in the mountains and the terrain.
But my adventure bike is, is, is not, it's, it's, I say that, but it's not good at either one of 'em. It's not, it's not a great road bike, and it's not the most capable dirt bike, but it, we do it, we do it, we get it done on him. So, um, that, that, I had to blame my son on this. So I, I'd lost a lot of weight. And was, was doing the adventure, uh, outdoors.
He just got, really got into the outdoors. So, um, I was in actually visiting him. My son lives in Idaho and we were, uh, he's a big dirt biker. He'd been riding dirt bikes for, for a long time. [01:05:00] And so, uh, we were sitting on his couch and he had a video on TV about the Idaho BDR, which is a back road discovery, uh, route.
Yeah, back road discovery route. And so there's out west, and now they're really expanding. They're out here a lot, but they've got, uh, a, a back road, basically a route that these guys have gone out and mapped out to ride as much off road as you can in any particular state. I, I think all the, all the 11 Western states have got a route, and now we've got one that goes through North Carolina.
We've got 'em, they're just everywhere. Florida, Texas has got 'em. They're, they're really expanding this company. It's a nonprofit outfit. Uh, check out the BDR, they're awesome. Um. And I, I said they, they were camping out on bikes and dirt bikes and I'm like, he didn't have a, an adventure bike at that point.
Uh, he just had dirt bikes. I said, uh, we should do that. I wanna do [01:06:00] that. Let's go do that. So I came home and within a couple weeks I had bought a, I'd bought a, I'd bought a bike before he did. And, uh, then he had to go out and, and buy a bigger bike because he's like that.
Riley: The one up dad.
Todd Packer: Um, yeah, of course, of course. Well, his cape, his, his riding abilities way, way better than mine.
So, um, but that's how that got started. So we started, we started doing that, and that has become absolutely, uh, what I live for, uh. I think about it, I, I obsess about it. So I've taken two things. I still like to backpack, don't get me wrong, and, and the weather's getting to where, um, it's cooling off out here.
And I'm really looking to do and looking, looking up forward to doing some, some, uh, solo backpacking. 'cause that's, I can't find anybody to go with me. So at 90% of what I do is, is solo, you know. But, um, again, it's where I get in my head and, and that's [01:07:00] my, that's my spot. I can go out and, and hike and, and, and solve all the world's problems and tell nobody about it.
But, um. Uh, but, but the adventure bikes have, have become a passion. It's, it's, it's spilled over now. I'm sitting in my shop right now, it's my motorcycle shop. And, uh, I bought a property out here that, that is really neat. It's got a rural fire station. This used to be a, a rural fire station. Um, it's got three bays where we're not talking the giant fire truck, I guess the three big giant trucks could fit in here, but they were more rural trucks that fa fit in here.
And, and I ended up purchasing, uh, one of these, uh, fire stations that was on, on my property. Basically, they, I couldn't really sell it. So, um. I had to buy it. So, um, anyway, I've turned this into my, my, my motorcycle shop. And as I'm looking [01:08:00] around here, like I just, it's, it's a mess. I've got a mess. It's, uh, become a, a huge problem for my wife, but it's great for me.
But it's, it's definitely taken over. And this is where, you know, uh, we talk, you talk about my days and what I do. Um, I, I have a, I'm so blessed because I have a job where I can, I can, I have time and that's what's changed. The big thing that's changed in my life is I have time now to, uh, to work on bikes and, and that's became a big thing.
I like to build bikes and work on bikes and ride bikes and, and, uh. Then I have the opportunity to go out west and ride with my son, and we've done some big trips and I use, I've done quite a few, you know, cross country trips on the bike and, and it's just, it's fantastic.
Riley: And so, so much so that you started a YouTube channel and I, I want to, I wanna talk about that man. 'cause. Like this [01:09:00] podcast and like, you know, so many other people do. We look at people on the internet and we think, oh, they were just made to do that. But you know, as, as I'm in the early stages of this podcast, you're in the beginning stages of this, this, uh, YouTube channel, you're sticking yourself out there for the public to, to judge you, right?
And so there's this, there's this insecurity that happens with that. And first, tell us what the name of the YouTube channel is, but then also talk about that insecurity, man, what it's like.
Todd Packer: Okay. Well you, you, you hit on something there that is important and I look at, uh, you know, I look at what you're doing and I'm gonna plug you because it's your personality. Ri um, I think personality, you have to have a little bit of a personality to do what you're doing and, and people are gonna watch you and watch you because they wanna watch Riley.
Um, [01:10:00] they wanna, they want to, they wanna hear you. Your opinion matters and you are, you're entertaining. I've went back and watched your old podcast and, um, I just thoroughly enjoy watching Riley. And that's what's gonna make,
Riley: Thank
Todd Packer: you a success, is because you're genuine. And, uh, I think you, um, you're just, you're just, you know, people are gonna wanna watch you.
You have that personality that people are drawn to and wanna, wanna you have, you have something to offer them. Um,
Riley: man. Thank you.
Todd Packer: you bet you. And that's, it's, that's, that's straight up. So, um. I have a very, uh, it's not an exciting life, but I enjoy life. I, I have a passion for life. And so, um, there's been people that have just said, Todd, I wish we could just follow you around with a camera and video.
What you do, just a day with you. You just, you just, you should, you should, you know, I, I didn't really have the, the [01:11:00] drive, uh, at first to do it. People were just like, Todd, you should, you should do this. You should. Um, I think people would wanna watch you. And I'm a big YouTube watcher, so I, I watch people. I have my niche that I watch, and I enjoy, uh, you know, gear.
I enjoy adventure. I enjoy the outdoors, and, and I'm, I'm passionate about it. So I, I take this very serious. It's not a. It's, it's, it's not a, uh, something that I just want to dip my toe in. And, uh, one thing about my personality is usually when I go in on something, I'm all in. Um, I went all in on backpacking.
I went all in. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't know if that's necessarily a good trait or not.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: Uh, I think to, to me it is, to my wife. It's probably, uh, not one of the greatest, uh, attributes that, that, that I have for our marriage. But, um, it's, it's not [01:12:00] a cheap, it's not a cheap, uh, it's not a cheap hobby and it's not a cheap endeavor.
But, um, but, so that's probably her, you know, that's probably her. Uh, you know, she's, she comes home and I'll have a new bike in the garage and be like, where'd that come from? Like, oh, that old thing, you know, it's been here for a while, but, um,
Riley: Gosh,
Todd Packer: but no, it's bad.
Riley: gotta
Todd Packer: Um. I know, I know. And my wife's the greatest.
She's super supportive. And, and, and we are a team. You know, we are, we are absolutely a team in everything that we do. And I wouldn't dream of doing anything that she wasn't on board with. Um, and I'm blessed that she supports, she supports all my craziness. Um, but that being said, um, gosh, I'm losing my train of thought here.
Ri um,
Riley: Coming back
Todd Packer: that being said,
Riley: of the channel and kind of how you've.
Todd Packer: yeah, yeah. Um, [01:13:00] I've gone back and watched, uh, people that I really highly, uh, uh, admire on YouTube. Okay. Uh, go back and watch their early videos when they first started out 10 years ago and watch their insecurities. And I go, man, if they, they're, they're the same. They're the same. I think the biggest thing that I deal with now is nobody's watching.
You know, nobody's watching you. You need to do it when nobody's watching. You know? And, and I, I, well, no, I'm saying that, that when you first start, you make your first video. You don't have anybody watching. There's nobody, there's, you don't have any viewers. You don't have any subscribers. So you're, you're putting it out there, but nobody's watching.
You know, it takes a little bit for people to, to start watching you and paying attention and, and, and actually give a crap about what you're [01:14:00] saying. You know what I mean?
Riley: real.
Todd Packer: um, how do you feel the same way.
Riley: Absolutely. Man. No, that, that in that insecurities is kind of real. That realization that, one of the things you mentioned there was you, you look back at these other people's early videos, and I did that, man. I remember, in fact, I remember years ago watching, uh, there's a channel Demolition Ranch. Right? And I remember seeing
Todd Packer: Oh yeah.
Riley: he was a young man. His videos were terrible. They. And I remember that was encouraging to me back then. I was like, oh, this dude's just getting started. Then I gotta see what he became and how good he became on camera and how comfortable he became and what a
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: kind of developed there and how he, he, he really found his voice and it was a, it was a great channel. And, uh, became one of the, you know, very influential YouTuber. And I, I thought,
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: man, this was just a kid who started doing some videos, and again, they were terrible at first. So why can't mine be terrible? You know, I, I'm gonna
Todd Packer: [01:15:00] Right.
Riley: five years from now and think, oh, this, this is, that's some bull crap that happened back there.
But you've gotta get
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: And I, it's given me a big respect for people. You know, you stick yourself
Todd Packer: Oh yeah.
Riley: realizing that, damn, I'm gonna suck at this for a while. but eventually I, I will get better just like everything else in life. Right.
Todd Packer: Right. But I feel like you have passion for what you do. And I think if you have that passion, uh, and you are excited about it, and, and I think you have to, you know, not take yourself too seriously. 'cause I don't take myself too seriously, so I'm able to, to joke around and, and when I do my editing, uh, people laugh 'cause I don't, I don't edit a lot of the stuff out.
If I make a mistake or I am talking nonsense, I'll usually leave it in because it's, it's, to me, it's more authentic than,
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: uh. In real. And [01:16:00] I've, I'm getting, the feedback I'm getting right now is people like that. People enjoy that. Um, that I'm more authentic and my, but my personality is starting to come out more in my videos as I get more comfortable.
And, um, I think you have to, and, and I, and don't take me, don't take this wrong, but like, I think you have to like yourself, I think you have to like your personality, your own personality to do this. I think that if you don't like that, it's not gonna come through. And I think you've gotta like it for other people to like it.
Does that make sense?
Riley: Yeah, man. I feel like one of the things as I was preparing for this podcast, you tell me if you experienced the same thing, is I would go listen to other people's and just for the sake of like, are they putting on a character? are they just being themselves and what did themselves look like? And
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: I don't know
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: listened to like [01:17:00] Lex Friedman or Sean Ryan or you know,
Todd Packer: Oh, yeah.
Riley: listened
Todd Packer: yeah.
Riley: Rogan and stuff.
But listen to these guys and they're just them and they're very different,
Todd Packer: Yes,
Riley: a super
Todd Packer: yes,
Riley: more energetic
Todd Packer: yes.
Riley: But then Lex Friedman is like, he's dry as a bone, but super interesting because he is just being Lex man. He is just doing his
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: he's not trying to put on a, a character that's fake and so it's authentic and so
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: relatable and it's like, cool man.
These guys are just being them.
Todd Packer: There, there, and there's, there's different types of YouTube, uh, YouTubers. Okay. There's guys that I watch to watch in the motorcycle genre that are, there's a guy named, uh, Ian that does, it's called Big Rock. Big Rock Moto, and he's done in California. And he, if you wanna know about a certain bike, he's the guy that you wanna, uh, if you wanna know about A-A-K-T-M six 90 [01:18:00] adventure, you google him on his channel and he's gonna go in depth.
Now, he's not the most energetic guy. He's not the most entertaining guy to listen to. He's not, uh, he's not, you know, but, but I go to him for information. He's my guy that I go watch if I wanna know every spec about that bike, if I wanna know the ins and outs, how tall it is, what it's like to ride it, um, every, you know, spec sheet.
You know, spec on that bike. He's the guy you go to, you know what I mean? But, um, but his personality is a little dry and a little bit deadpan, you know what I mean? But I still watch everything he makes because he is just a very knowledgeable and he does a good job. He's got a niche and he goes there and, you know, that's what he does.
And I, I, I not say I don't like him because I enjoy his videos and I, it's [01:19:00] him. Um, but, but then there's guys that I watch that are just, they're just fun to watch. I just, they make you feel good to watch them. And so I kinda wanna go somewhere in between, kind of right in the middle there. I kind of wanna be somebody that, um, uh, you can come to for information on, on it, but that my passion comes through and that people are like, gosh, this guy's kind of funny.
And I, I, uh, enjoy watching his video. So,
Riley: Your
Todd Packer: um.
Riley: I've seen so
Todd Packer: I hope that's where I'm at.
Riley: your videos that I've seen so far are very much just you, man. 'cause you're in, in personal conversation. You're a bit goofy. The jokes are flying all the time. There's a little
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: there. There's, there's, you know, there's all these things and sometimes I think when we first start we're, we're very dry.
'cause we just are nervous as
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: You get on there and it's
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: don't, I don't know what to do. I'm just a redneck from Idaho. You know? And, uh, as you get more [01:20:00] comfortable, those jokes can start to come out. And as people get to know you more, some of the. You know, I think about some insider jokes can start coming, coming through because you're, you've connected with the audience at a certain level. Um, but I, I wanna ask, man, have you, have you had, you had the hater comments yet?
Todd Packer: Wait, not a lot. Not a lot. I don't really have the hater comments. Um, we've got a few where the, not the know-it-all, the know-it-all, you know what I mean? We had a video that, uh, we had a bike breakdown. We were out in Idaho and, uh, a bike broke down and we ended up, we were kind of wrenching on this bike and there was, there was a guy that was telling us all the stuff we were doing wrong.
You know what I mean? All the stuff we were doing wrong and, and it's not what we thought it was. It's this, and, and you know, you're [01:21:00] gonna get that. And I don't, it doesn't bother me. I, it makes me, again, it kind of goes back to my guy that, uh, the one upper guy that I was talking about. I kind of go, you know what, that's, you're gonna have that.
And I. Any comments? A good comment. So I'll take 'em, you know, I'll take 'em. Let's, let's, let's hear it. You know, uh, and I, I hope to be the type of guy that I've got pretty big shoulders and I pretty, I let a lot of stuff just roll off me in life. And so I hope that I can transition that into, into my YouTube videos and not, not let, I mean, you're gonna get it, but, and not that I don't care 'cause I do care, but I hope that I can let a lot of that just slide off.
Riley: Because I had a, some law enforcement, um. Yes, on my podcast. And in fact, uh, there's an episode, maybe the one that launched today, I'm trying to, trying to remember, [01:22:00] um, is law enforcement too. And you know, that's a, for whatever reason, he's got these people out there who hate cops no matter what. You know, it's like
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: they just, and I've, I've got a few of those comments where I'm just like, dude, this guy's just
Todd Packer: I.
Riley: out, you know?
And I really care what he has to say, but, you know, thanks for the
Todd Packer: Right, right.
Riley: you wound up emotional
Todd Packer: Yes,
Riley: make a
Todd Packer: yes,
Riley: just 'cause I had a certain guest on the show then. Great man. Hope that, hope that sticks with you.
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: Uh,
Todd Packer: And I, and you know, my, you know, my stance politically, I'm very, I'm a conservative guy and I'm, I, I, you know, I think a little bit of that comes out, uh, and I, I'm proud of it. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna shy away from it, but I, I am gonna try to not be political on my, you know, on my genre, my niche.
It's just gonna be, you know, uh, it's just gonna be motorcycle. That's what I love. That's what I like, you know, and, [01:23:00] and, and camping and stuff like that.
Riley: I hear what you're saying 'cause it's, it's funny, you know, I'm, I'm so involved in the juujitsu world, but this is not a
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: right. This is a, this is a
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: podcast and a lot of those people that I
Todd Packer: Oh, great.
Riley: to that are high achievers are in the juujitsu world, but not all of them.
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: but two juujitsu guys, man, we can just get talking about that. And all of a sudden had to dial back a couple episodes where I'm like, wait a second, we gotta get off this subject 'cause we're getting down this path where I'm gonna start boring the rest of the audience who isn't
Todd Packer: right,
Riley: thing, you know?
So stick with your niche is what I'm getting at there is
Todd Packer: right, right.
Riley: so yeah, man, I think it's fascinating stuff. I think it's cool as heck that you're, you're doing this and we're kind of paralleled up in the, the timeframe of this whole thing as we're, we're both building this
Todd Packer: Yeah,
Riley: new venture.
Todd Packer: it's fun. You know, I, I talked about, you know, there and, and who was it? Who was it? Was it,
I'm trying to remember the [01:24:00] guy that said it. I think it was, uh. Ronald Reagan, but I don't think it was Ronald Reagan for some reason. That's sticking in my head about, uh, find something that you enjoy doing. Do your hobby and make your hobby your job, and you'll never work a day in your life. Somebody will know who, who, whose famous quote that was.
But I felt that way with trucking is I've, I've enjoyed trucking my whole life and when I was doing it hardcore, it didn't feel like work. It didn't feel like a job. I was just lucky and I felt lucky to be doing that. And that's where I'm at now is I am, I am doing this and yeah, it. You're finding out as much as I do that it's, it's work.
You have to, uh, make your videos, you have to edit the videos, you have to, uh, it's a commitment. You know, I, I try, it's a product, you know, and I do take it serious. So I want to give people [01:25:00] the best product that I can give them of myself and the information and entertainment value, hope that comes through.
Um, so it's work, it becomes a job. But I hope that I love it, and I'm having so much fun. That's what my, my wife says the same thing. She says, Hey, as long as you're having fun, I support the time and the effort and even the money that, that you're putting into it to, to, um, to do this as long as you're having fun.
You know, and you're enjoying it. And that's what I hope. I just feel blessed to be having fun, uh, and I'm doing what I wanna do. I says, motorcycles are what I love and outdoors is what I love. And so, gosh, why not? Why not? It's, it's fun.
Riley: So, Todd, let's switch gears a little bit. I got some lighter questions I'd like to ask, ask my guests and you know, uh, when you, you're on the go Earn your SALT podcast right now, and when you hear that term, go earn your salt, [01:26:00] what does it mean to you?
Todd Packer: I, I and I, and I debated on where my go wearing your salt shirt today. I didn't know if that would be over the top.
Riley: No, that would've been cool, man. That would've been bonus points
Todd Packer: I like, oh, would ri appreciate it or not? But I, I should wear my, but I wear that shirt, I wear that shirt probably, uh, at least every once every two weeks I wear my go on your salt shirt. You know what I mean? And what I love about is, is the reactions I get from other people and what it means to them. You know what I mean?
But go on. Your salt means, uh, go out and sweat. Go out and do what you do. Do your passion and put the effort into it. Go earn your salt. Um, uh. I know what, I know what perspiration is. I know what hard work is. I've always been a worker. I'm a, I've always been, I'm not patting myself on the back. I'm not saying I'm, you know, but work is something [01:27:00] that I enjoy doing.
I, I like putting my, um, I'm not an idle person. Even, even, even when I was, was heavy, I, my job was driving truck and I, I was, I was in it, you know, and I loved driving truck and put in the time. Um, so that's what it means to me is putting your effort into it and, and, and not just, not just doing it a lacka daisy that you gotta, you earn it and you gotta put a little sweat into it.
Riley: Nice,
Todd Packer: That's what it means to me.
Riley: Todd, what's your favorite band of all time?
Todd Packer: Even a band, gosh, RI
Riley: Shoot.
Todd Packer: a, I'm a music guy. If you look on my arm here. I've got a tattoo of a VU meter and anybody who grew up in the eighties and had a big boombox, uh, every, every boombox had that vu meter on it. So that's my homage to, to music. I'm a big, I'm a big [01:28:00] music guy. Um, I don't, I would probably have to say, um, Um, Bob Seger is not necessarily a band, but, but I would say Bob Seger, if I had to go to, my favorite, uh, favorite musician would be, would be Bob Seger, hands down.
Riley: Oh, goodness,
Todd Packer: I, I have a big spectrum.
Riley: What is something
Todd Packer: Do you.
Riley: oh, go ahead. Go ahead.
Todd Packer: Did you? Um, and on the Bob Seger, um, I'm a big ZZ Top fan. I love ZZ Top. I love Billy Gibbons. Um, I've gone and seen, uh, ZZ Top perform a couple times, and I just love, they're one of my favorites. And, and, um, he got his, uh, ZZ Top is as great as they are, were inspired by, by Bob Seger. And if you listen to Bob [01:29:00] Seger play his guitar and you listen to Billy Gibbons play his guitar, um, they link up the, the, the rhythms that, that, that riffs.
Um, it's Bob, it's Bob Seger all day long. And a lot of people don't, you know, get that deep into it. But, um, CZ hops one of the all times greats and, and, and his, he's patterned off of, off of, uh, of his style is off of, uh, of Bob Seeger.
Riley: dude, man.
Todd Packer: Anyway,
Riley: So.
Todd Packer: I digress.
Riley: I'm,
Todd Packer: Digress.
Riley: the opposite. I've, I've never been much of a music fan and I have my favorite bands and stuff, but, you know, I, I honestly, I could count 'em on my hand. And so noting the, that you realize that there's similarity between two mu musicians that would go right over my head, man. It's so Now I'm gonna have to go check it out though. I wanna hear it.
Todd Packer: You gotta go check it out.
Riley: Uh, Todd, what's something quirky about you that people don't know?
Todd Packer: Worky?[01:30:00]
Um,
probably that, uh, I'm not a big action movie guy. I like, I'm more of a romantic comedy guy than I am a than I am a, um, action. Shoot him up, you know? Uh, a movie guy I don't like, I don't like, uh, I, I, I don't like, I don't like that stuff, you know what I mean?
Riley: into
Todd Packer: Um. No, that's, well, that's, that's too far. That's, that's the line of where it ends right there.
You know what I mean? But I'm just not a shoot 'em up. Um, uh, action, you know, guns a blazing. You know, I can't stand that stuff, so I, I, I'd rather watch a, I'd rather watch a romantic comedy with my wife than, than that. I don't know if that's quirky or not, but that's a fact.
Riley: mean, I count that. So what, what, uh, what's your favorite movie?
Todd Packer: [01:31:00] Oh gosh. I don't know if I have a favorite movie. Oh, my favorite movie of all time is Lonesome Dove. That's easy. That's so easy. That Lonesome Dove.
Riley: I don't know if I've ever even
Todd Packer: You remember that show? Oh my gosh. Ri It's a Western, um, it's a, it was actually not a movie. It was a, uh, it's a mini series. It was on tv. Uh, it was made for television, but it's, it's, it's like six hours long.
But it's a, it is just a big western. It's got, uh, uh, Tommy Lee Jones and, and, uh, oh, what's the other guy? But probably his two old, oh dude, it's such a good goat. Lonesome Dove is the, is the greatest movie in the world.
Riley: I'll have to
Todd Packer: Yeah,
Riley: 'cause
Todd Packer: fan. It's, it's the greatest, yeah. Oh, why? Okay. And then I've got one more and that's Smokey and The Bandit.
Come on. I mean, come on. Smokey. And the Bandit is,
Riley: I just
Todd Packer: I watched that the other day. [01:32:00] It was on, it was on YouTube. It showed up on, I've got it. A copy of it. But, um, yeah, if it's, yeah. Smokey in the band. It's,
Riley: All
Todd Packer: I that never gets old.
Riley: here of something that, I thought about this earlier in the podcast when you were talking about just loving trucks. As a kid, I didn't realize this, but I had these two kind of big, I don't know, two foot long semi-truck toys. When I was little, I was three,
Todd Packer: Okay.
Riley: is when my parents were still married, and they got divorced when I was four.
Todd Packer: Oh, wow. Yep. Yep.
Riley: I don't know if you remember those, but I got 'em for Christmas one year. But they were the smoky and the bandit semis. Do you remember those?
Todd Packer: Okay. Uhhuh. Uhhuh.
Riley: Okay.
Todd Packer: I don't remember you getting them, but,
Riley: So I
Todd Packer: but I remember those.
Riley: and I, I remember it because I, I'm pretty sure we were out at your house in Blackfoot when I got these, that's when I
Todd Packer: Okay.
Riley: at Christmas time. And I just love those trucks. I thought the, the black and gold one was beautiful and it was like,
Todd Packer: Oh, yeah.
Riley: the best looking [01:33:00] semi-truck in the world. Again, this little boy. But I'd really liked that, that toy. I had forgotten about it. Um, all these years go by, you know, and I'm 48 years old now, long since it, not thought about those, those toys.
But when I watched the movie here just a few weeks ago, one of those trucks is in there. It's, you know, off the movie.
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: seeing it in the, the, the, it's like a, if I remember like a wagon and it had some horses on the side of the trailer or something.
Todd Packer: Yep, yep, yep.
Riley: dude, it was like these childhood memories come flooding back in my mind.
I was like, oh, had those trucks. And I, I loved it,
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: made me think of you. 'cause like I said, I think we were at your house when, when I unwrapped those. Isn't that wild?
Todd Packer: That's funny. That is funny, dude. That's cool.
Riley: Alright. Switching gears. Pizza stick or thin crust.
Todd Packer: It Finn.
Riley: Finn, I'm with you, man. All day.
Todd Packer: Yeah. Finn. Yeah.
Riley: How about those ones where they put the sauce on top of the cheese?
Is that okay?
Todd Packer: No, [01:34:00] it's not. Okay.
Riley: Not okay. Right.
Todd Packer: That's not acceptable.
Riley: Dude, we are related. Todd, have you ever been
Todd Packer: Yeah, I have
Riley: You tell.
Todd Packer: great, great, um, um, I, I think
call me crazy, but I think every, every, every five years you should get in a fight. Um, I do, I do. Uh, the, uh, the dopamine dump that you get from, from, from fighting is, is, is greater than any, any, um, dopamine dump. I'm a, I am and you know me. Ri I'm even keeled. I am, I'm always right here. You know what I'm saying?
I'm always right here. Um, I, I don't, I, my highs and lows are, [01:35:00] are very manageable. I just kind of. You know, coast along. So 90% of the time, I'm, I'm, I'm even. But every once in a while I think you gotta just, you just gotta get it out and, um. Fighting is just one of those things that, uh, I think I let things build up.
I don't, I don't get it out enough, so I let it build up. And then if I find the opportunity, uh, this is probably horrible, then I just, I, I, if I find the opportunity and something comes up, then you get the aggression out and it's just the, it's, it's like, like I'm high for three days, you know what I mean?
After being in a fight. But, uh, trucking, trucking I think is always giving me that opportunity to put, be in a position where, you know, somebody makes you mad or somebody, and I'm not the aggressor. I'm not gonna, I'm not a bully. I don't go around and, and, and pick fights, you know what I mean? But, [01:36:00] um, but I'll, uh, if I see an opportunity where I, where it, it presents itself, um, yeah, I like to fight.
It's not bad.
Riley: Oh my gosh. No, it's a, I think that's a dude thing for, yep.
Todd Packer: It might be, it might be.
Riley: I,
Todd Packer: It might be
Riley: yeah, there's a reason I do jiujitsu, right? It gets me in those
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: on a daily basis and it's uh,
Todd Packer: right, right.
Riley: turn out good 'cause
Todd Packer: Is it,
Riley: but we all like to fight each other and.
Todd Packer: is it the same, is it the same ri Do you get that dopamine dump of just, you know,
Riley: Um,
Todd Packer: don't, you
Riley: no,
Todd Packer: what? Give what I mean.
Riley: really learned about it is there's, there is a dopamine dump. Don't, don't, but I don't get the, um, the adrenaline spike that, that's, I guess what I'm going for. The dopamine's real after a,
Todd Packer: Right, right.
Riley: grappling with people and, you know, you're,
Todd Packer: Oh yeah.
Riley: each other's neck or break each other's arms.
And it's a,
Todd Packer: Right,
Riley: is, [01:37:00] when it's done at the end of the evening, man, we're all just laying there in a puddle of sweat going, oh, this is the greatest
Todd Packer: right.
Riley: So,
Todd Packer: Right. So, so what do you do for that dopamine dump? Like I get it from dirt bike riding. I get it from, uh, I know there's motorcycle people that like to ride motorcycles, but I'm, I like riding off road and, and what I'm riding off, me and my wife went riding this weekend and we were on a, on a, you know, a trail and you're just dealing with what's in front of you right now.
Just instantly, your mind's just, the mind can't be anywhere. You can't be focused on work or anything. Like you gotta be the next 10 feet and, and what the train is and, and, and your decision making is happening so fast that I can, that's my, that's my, that's my release and it's my dopa. I mean, I just love it.
What do you have something like [01:38:00] that,
Riley: Yeah, man. No,
Todd Packer: that you do? I know.
Riley: describe that exact thing. It's that I have to focus on this, this person, what's going on right now. The rest of life's problems can't even enter in because I'm [01:39:00] so
Todd Packer: Right.
Riley: on not getting choked right now. Right.
Todd Packer: Right. That makes sense. That makes sense.
Riley: And that,
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: the same thing, man.
The focus is so total when it's done, you're just like, oh man, I did this thing. And it's amazing. And, uh, it's addicting for the exactly the same reasons,
Todd Packer: Yes, yes,
Riley: you know?
Todd Packer: yes. There's a sense of accomplishment with maybe getting on a, a difficult trail or at, or going fast on a difficult section that, um, that you just feel like you've accomplished them as, as such of accomplishment. And, and that's, that's why I ride dirt bikes.
Riley: Exactly the same. You know, and I, I do that with distance running. I do that with, on my mountain bike, a giant mountain in front of me. I gotta climb that sucker, you know, without an engine, you know, it's, uh, and it, it gets you that same
Todd Packer: Right, right, right.
Riley: of that, it's like, all right, man, I did it.
That's, that's awesome. Um,
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: Todd, what's the scariest moment of your life?[01:40:00]
Todd Packer: Scariest moment of my life.
That's a tough one.
The day my son was born,
um, he was, he was born, um, with some, you know, he wasn't breathing when he was born. And I thought, and my, my wife at the time was, was having difficulties, uh, um, with the, with the childbirth and there for about two hours. I thought I was gonna lose 'em both.
I was devastated. I didn't know, I didn't know what I was gonna do for those two hours. That was ter I was terrified. I didn't know what if my son was gonna live, and I didn't know if my wife was gonna live, and I thought I was [01:41:00] gonna lose 'em both. And I, I was, uh, going between, between my son and, and my wife and, and I was, I was, I was, I was 100% lost for about two hours.
That was the scariest time of my life. It all worked out. It all worked out. But that was, that was, that was the most terrifying thing in my life.
Riley: Dude, man, I don't know that I knew that man. I don't this first. Yeah, I didn't know that.
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: stuff. Um.
Todd Packer: And you know, it's, it trumps, it trumps, it trumps everything. There's, you know, you can have experiences, but when it comes to people and, and, uh. My son, uh, is my best friend. And, and as far as a guy friend, um, he's, he is, I only have one son, and so we're very close. My, my wife is my best friend. Uh, and so as my partner, she's my partner, she's my life [01:42:00] partner, and she is my, she's my everything.
Um, but my son is, is probably my best friend that, you know, we, we have the same interests and we have, um, we do, we do, we do. We're friends, you know what I mean? And, and so, uh, I've got a special relationship with him and I'm thankful for that. But, um, but yeah, that was absolutely the, and it, and it was instant because I never had a son before.
I never had a child before, and all of a sudden I've got one and, and, and I thought I was gonna lose it. So, um, it, it's funny how that switch just goes when you have a kid. It's like you can't explain it. It was instant. So that was scary.
Riley: Yeah, this one's a little tougher. One. What's the, what's the best advice you've ever received?
Todd Packer: Oh man,
stay in the boat[01:43:00]
Riley: Say
Todd Packer: you gotta stay, you gotta stay to stay in the boat. Um, stay in the boat that I have my convictions. Um, I belief in God. And my belief is, is as, as, as is. And life can get in the way of that. And you can even, even my hobbies and, and life and, and the outside, uh, the outside influences can affect our lives.
And I, I, I, I try to, um. No matter what, no matter what happens in my life, I need to stay in the boat and keep, keep, you know, there was, and, and where that came from was, was, um, uh, river rafting. And I'm not a river raft. I'm terrified of water. I'm terrified of water. But, uh, it goes back to guys that go [01:44:00] whitewater rafting, and they, they're going through the rapids, they're going through the, the whitewater, and the guy says, Hey, you know what, if I do, you know, um.
What do I do? And the guy's like, just stay in the boat. Just, just hold on. Stay, just stay in the boat. Don't fall out of the boat. Don't get out there in that whitewater. And that's the best advice I've ever, I've ever got is, is one of, one of my best friends out here is, you know, we talk about life and, and, and God and beliefs.
And he's like, just no matter what, stay in the boat. Um, stay grounded. Don't get out and don't get out of the boat. Don't get out in the white water. Don't get out and try to swim through it. Just stay, stay in the boat and stay grounded and you'll get through it. You'll get through it and let it and ride it out, but don't get out.
I don't know if that makes sense or not, but
Riley: Sense,
Todd Packer: me it's, it's, it's, it's profound.
Riley: Yeah. Todd, what's something on your bucket list?
Todd Packer: Um, [01:45:00] oh, that's easy. I've got, I've got several I want to go and, um. I want to go soon as, as soon as possible. And, and ride, uh, over the Himalayas on dirt bikes. Me and my son was, we wanna take a trip and, and go to India and, uh, and rent bikes and, and ride, ride over the Himalayas and just to do it together.
That's my bucket list.
Riley: That
Todd Packer: got several trips, but that's, that's on the highest, that's the highest list.
Riley: That sounds cool. is
Todd Packer: That's that. Be cool.
Riley: a book that you would recommend everyone read?
Todd Packer: Well, the obvious one is a Bible. Maybe that's cliche, you know what I mean?
Riley: Yeah. Besides
Todd Packer: Uh, call me,
Riley: you
Todd Packer: call me cliche. But, um, the, the book, um, I. I know, and again, it's, [01:46:00] it's cliche, but there's, you know, seven Habits of successful People. Have you read that book?
Riley: Yeah. Is it the Seven, seven Habits of Highly Effective People? Is that what you're
Todd Packer: Yes. Yes. Yes.
Riley: that's,
Todd Packer: Um.
Riley: definitely a good book, man.
Todd Packer: Um, I also, I also read, uh, and again, it's not political, it's political, but I wrote, uh, I read, uh, George Bush's book called The Decision Point about his decisions, you know, after nine 11 and, uh, say what you want about George Bush. But, um, it put it in a whole different perspective for me, and I have nothing but respect for what that man went through.
And, and I was in the military, um, and, um, served under his, his dad, you know what I mean? But I was never in the Marines when George Bush was president. But, um, that was, that [01:47:00] was a really good book. It's called Decision Point, if I remember right.
Riley: sit back at a distance and judge people's decisions after we've got all the information or think we do,
Todd Packer: Right. I think we do. Yeah.
Riley: spot with less information.
Todd Packer: Yes.
Riley: yeah,
Todd Packer: Yeah. That was a good book.
Riley: armchair quarterback kind kind of thing.
Todd Packer: Right, right, right, right.
Riley: Um, Todd, what's, uh, what's next for you, man?
What are you, whatcha gonna do from here? I.
Todd Packer: That's easy. I'm gonna, uh, keep my nose to the grindstone and, and just keep, keep, uh, I, I, I take this, uh, my, my YouTube, uh, uh, aspirations very seriously. So, um, I, I've got big aspirations. I want to, I wanna keep doing that and, and just enjoy, like I say, I've always enjoyed driving truck and, and transition from this, that, into doing [01:48:00] something that I love.
And, uh, now I've got, you know, we talk about, uh, we talk about, um. Goals, you know, I've got some high goals. I've got some trips that I want to go into. Uh, this'll, this'll kind of, uh, um, uh, go into what your neck of the woods. There's a race, there's a race on, uh, next a year Memorial Day in Idaho City called the, uh, Idaho City 100.
Riley: Yeah.
Todd Packer: it's a, it's a two day dirt bike race, uh, a single track Enduro race. And, uh, I, I would, me, and me and Cade would like to go and, and, and his friend Kenton News, an amazing rider. That's, if anybody watches my channel that, uh, would know Kenton, it's, it's, uh, he's a good buddy of ours out in Idaho. But, um, I would like to be physically, uh, able to, to ride that race and [01:49:00] not necessarily, uh, you know, just, just to finish.
Just to finish it would be, would be awesome. I.
Riley: A challenging race, man. I,
Todd Packer: You know, have you been
Riley: I've been up to it and watched it several times and
Todd Packer: got?
Riley: almost, uh, signed up for it. A friend of mine and I, we had these old dirt bikes, these old 1980s dual shockers. We were gonna go up there and race
Todd Packer: That's awesome.
Riley: and, uh, we had some people experienced in it. They're like. Guys, that's, it's a rough race and you, you need to have a worthy machine.
And these are not worthy machines. So we, we opted out, but it, uh, yeah, that's a, that's some crazy terrain up there, man. Really fun.
Todd Packer: Yeah, I would like to, I'd like to go do that. That's kind of on our, and it's, it's a new thing that we're talking about, but we're talking about again, physically, just to be able to ride that for two days. Just phy the physicality of it. Is it just, it's gonna take some work on a, you know, on all of us parts.
I am, [01:50:00] I am, I am 53 years old. Ri I don't, uh, I don't. Feel 53 in my head, my body feels 53, but mentally I'm, I don't feel 53. I know that sounds crazy, but, um, I've talked to lots of people that are a lot older than me that, that say the same thing about being 80. My dad's, um, you know, getting up there and he's in his eighties, but, uh, he's got some little bit of, uh, dementia going on right now.
But up until that he was like, he's said, I don't feel, I don't feel seventies. I don't feel that I, I still feel like a young guy. So my, my mind still thinks the way I did in my twenties, uh, for the most part as far as, as, as is, uh, um, hopes and dreams. But, um, uh, I don't even know where I was going with that.
But I, there's reality and so I, I'm not, I'm physically able to. To ride and be a, a good rider, but I need to, uh, [01:51:00] my body is my limitation at this point. Not my brain. My brain says I can do anything, but my body's a limitation. And then, so I really wanna, I really want to, I don't have, I'm not as strong, you know, even when I was, even when I was, uh, heavy, I was strong.
I know that sounds crazy, but, uh, physically I was, I was a little heavier weight, but I was, I was way stronger than I am now. So I'm, I've lost a lot of weight, but I've lost a lot of muscle. And so, um, um, I used to have, I used to have big arms and, and they're long gone. So I really want to get, I really wanna get, um.
Get, you know, in physical, you know, better shape and it's harder when you turn 50.
Riley: Sure.
Todd Packer: um, that's really on my bucket list, is to, I eat right and I eat pretty healthy. I eat, I eat pretty clean now, but, um, I really need to get, you know, physically I need to get some strength and, and flexibility to do, to, to keep doing what I wanna do.
But, [01:52:00] uh, but I've got goals and all and, uh, it's fun to, to, to work on it every day, you know what I mean?
Riley: Yeah. tell us where you can be found, man. What's the, what's the YouTube channel name? I.
Todd Packer: Okay. Uh, it's called adventure biography, so, uh, uh, it's adventurous. Uh, dashy, um. And they're one of my favorite, uh, musicians sing a song called, uh, cowboy Biography. Had an album called Cowboy Biography. Be a western singer out there. And he was actually a Canadian guy, but I always, I always liked that song or that the, the, uh, the title of his album was, you know, he talked about being a, a cowboy or, uh, as guess cowboy biography, you know, and so I always liked that.
So I thought it'd be a, a, a fun thing to, to, to pattern my channel off of a, of adventure biography and uh, kind of a story of adventure and my story. So that's where you can find [01:53:00] me.
Riley: Awesome, man. We'll put a link in the description so that everybody can click on that and see
Todd Packer: That'd be great. That'd be great. I appreciate it.
Riley: yeah
Todd Packer: be great.
Riley: Well, Todd, that's, uh, we're gonna wrap it up here, but I appreciate you coming on, dude. I'd, I'd love hearing about the
Todd Packer: Absolutely.
Riley: kind of, you know, again, walking through these stages of both our parts of, of building these new ventures and, know, finding our voice and
Todd Packer: Exciting
Riley: You know, walk through some of the same insecurities and the, you know, trying to, trying to find our spot in this world of media. Right. And I, uh, I think it's cool. I think it's really cool. So thanks for coming to visiting
Todd Packer: and it's fun. Absolutely. Absolutely. Riley. It's an honor. It's a pleasure. I really appreciate it and, and, uh, I support everything you're doing. You're a good dude.
Riley: Oh man. It's been a pleasure. Todd. Dude,
Todd Packer: Yeah.
Riley: Go Earn Your SALT!
Todd Packer: Thanks for the opportunity. I will, man.
[01:54:00]